RONNIE ELLIS
CNHI
LEXINGTON —
Trey Grayson got aggressive with Rand Paul Monday night during the KET program Kentucky Tonight, saying Paul doesn't understand a popular anti-drug program in eastern Kentucky. Paul fired back, at first accusing Grayson of "intellectual dishonesty," saying Grayson "makes up the facts."
The two are the chief rivals in the Republican Primary for the U.S. Senate, and while Grayson was once thought to be the presumptive nominee, Paul has surged ahead in most independent polls. Paul campaigns against federal spending, including earmarks by individual congressman directing federal funds back to their home districts.
Paul said he "would not engage in earmarks," calling them "symbolic of what's gone wrong in Washington," and said projects should be based on the "objective merits." He criticized Grayson for wanting to 'reform' earmarks rather than eliminate them.
Grayson responded by pointing out a popular anti-drug program in southeastern Kentucky called UNITE, funded originally by an earmark by Republican Congressman Hal Rogers who has endorsed Grayson. Grayson said a Kentucky congressman knows the state's needs better than a bureaucrat.
"He doesn't know anything about UNITE," Grayson said. "I think that's embarrassing."
Paul said the country shouldn't go to war without a congressional debate and a declaration of war. Grayson said the threat of military action shouldn't be "taken off the table" and reiterated his charge that Paul has said a nuclear armed Iran isn't a threat.
Paul called that "intellectually dishonest," but Grayson responded that Paul was video taped saying it, adding, "It's not taken out of context, it's just his old position."
Two other candidates, John Stephenson and Gurley L. Martin, often were sideline observers as Grayson and Paul battled over every issue and attacked each other. At one point, Martin interjected, "This is not a two-way debate," but Grayson and Paul continued to direct fire on the other. (The fifth candidate, Jon Scribner didn't appear. Program host Bill Goodman said Scribner had a death in his family.)
Stephenson used his trademark line, that the country doesn't need a "left turn or a right turn, but a u-turn back to God" and promised to release his tax returns every year he's in office and for one year afterward. He said the country has lost its moral core.
Grayson and Paul didn't really disagree on qualifications for Supreme Court justices. Grayson said he'd quiz nominees on whether they believe in "limited constitutional government" while Paul said he'd ask if they believe in expansion of the commerce clause, something he contends has been used to expand the role of government. He also used his standard lines about "out-of-control" spending and debt, while Grayson went out of his way to say he'd been endorsed by Kentucky Right to Life.
Grayson continued to pound Paul on national security issues, implying Paul had given a speech "on anti-war radio" against the war in Iraq.
Paul, Grayson and Martin said they support the death penalty but Stephenson said he had problems with the death penalty because of its unequal application.
Grayson asked Paul why for six months his website advocated closing Guantanamo Bay, something Paul disputed and again amd said Grayson took his words out of contest. As they tried to out-talk the other, Martin interjected, "You're destroying each other."
Grayson also hit Paul on abortion positions he's taken in the past, claiming Paul wants to leave the issue to the states. Paul said, "It's hard to debate anything with Trey because he just makes up the facts."
He then called Grayson's charges "absolute gutter trash," invoking his children who attend Catholic schools and are "taught abortion is wrong." Paul asked Grayson how to manage social security which he said is going bankrupt. Grayson responded by saying both political parties come together and work on a solution while a growing economy can "put off the day of reckoning."
Paul said the retirement age should be raised gradually so younger people can prepare. Without that, he said the payroll tax would have to be tripled or quadrupled and said he'd never vote for that.
Paul sidestepped again an email question about whether he'd vote for Sen. Mitch McConnell as Republican Leader saying he sometimes disagrees with McConnell and that he couldn't promise to vote for McConnell without knowing who the alternative candidate might be.
Grayson said he would "proudly vote for Sen. McConnell."
Ronnie Ellis writes for CNHI News Service and is based in Frankfort, Ky. He may be contacted by email at rellis@cnhi.com. Follow CNHI News Service stories on Twitter at www.twitter.com/cnhifrankfort.
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